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Brathwaite resigns from IGDA Women in Games SIG

Brathwaite resigns from IGDA Women in Games SIG

Fri 29 Mar 2013 2:57am GMT / 10:57pm EDT / 7:57pm PDT
PoliticsPeopleGDC 2013

GDC 2013: Industry veteran quits over dancers at trade body party

Industry veteran Brenda Romero (née: Brathwaite) has resigned from her position as co-chair of the IGDA Women in Games SIG after the US trade body featured scantily-clad female dancers at its GDC party for the second year in a row.

The dancers, and other entertainment, had been provided by mobile funding outfit YetiZen. The group was the lead sponsor for the event for the second year running, despite causing outcry last year by providing similarly inappropriate dancers.

"I have been a long-time supporter of the IGDA," said Romero to Polygon. "However, my silence would have been complicity. I had no choice. And just hours after our panel, too."

Romero had been speaking at GDC the day before on how the use of booth babes at trade shows like E3 was unacceptable, encouraging the objectification of women and creating barriers for them within the industry.

The IGDA's Executive Director Kate Edwards has since issued an apology for the incident.

"As many of you know, the IGDA was a co-presenter of the Yetizen party Tuesday evening. We recognize that some of the performers' costumes at the party were inappropriate, and also some of the activities they performed were not what we expected or approved.

"We regret that the IGDA was involved in this situation. We do not condone activites that objectify or demean women or any other group of people. One of the core values of the IGDA is encouraging inclusion and diversity. Obviously we need to be more vigilant in our efforts. We intend to be so in the future."

GamesIndustry International interviewed Edwards on the Monday of GDC, speaking to her about the issues facing both female developers and gender issue in the industry as a whole. A complete transcript of that exchange will be published next week.

43 Comments

Christophe Danguien
games developer

67 82 1.2
It's quite insane to react like that, the only reason why she does that and others have resigned too is because it has been posted on internet. It was already like that last year and they didn't resign, so....stop being hypocrite guys.

More over, the girls weren't naked, it was a party, not like they were giving a speech at the same time or something. And yeah if it would have been men dancing in the same costume, I wouldn't really care. If you don't like it, you just stick to the conferences, and you don't go to the parties...

Posted:A year ago

#1

Christopher Bowen
Editor in Chief

400 523 1.3
... And that post above is *the problem*. They had a panel relating to the #1reasonwhy hashtag that went over problems women have in the industry *THAT FREAKING DAY*.

Posted:A year ago

#2

Jessica Hyland
Character Artist

237 794 3.4
Popular Comment
Way to totally miss the point, Christophe... Brenda was vocally unhappy about the choice of entertainment at last year's party. Seeing the same mistake repeated(just hours after the amazing #1ReasonToBe talk she spoke in, even) is presumably what broke the camel's back for her. The IGDA has apologised profusely for it, they agree it was tactless and offputting for many attendees. Many of my friends are at GDC right now and I saw a lot of shock and disgust being communicated on Facebook and Twitter - from men and women, might I add - that the IGDA apparently deemed dancing girls a good choice of entertainment for their party. IGDA is supposed to represent all game developers, not alienate so many of them.
If you don't like it, you just stick to the conferences, and you don't go to the parties...
That's a terrible way to promote inclusivity. 'Don't like seeing women objectified for no good reason? Don't you dare complain, just avoid it.' That's not how problems get solved.

Edited 1 times. Last edit by Jessica Hyland on 29th March 2013 6:55pm

Posted:A year ago

#3

Paul Johnson
Managing Director / Lead code monkey

799 996 1.2
Popular Comment
lmao, this is excellent. "This is wrong because I don't like it." I do not want to live in a world where fringe group activists starting sucking the fun out of everything.

As usual this was followed up with mealy mouthed "we don't want to offend anybody" bullshit apologies. My response woud have been. "You don't like these women here? Fine, fuck off."

And I'm not missing the point. It probably was a wrong move given the headlines, but I still prefer the outcome of people claiming to be passionate about something throwing their toys out of the pram and behaving more childishly than who they accuse. Priceless.

Edited 1 times. Last edit by Paul Johnson on 29th March 2013 8:52pm

Posted:A year ago

#4

Yiannis Koumoutzelis
Founder & Creative Director

358 187 0.5
I dunno what happened to my previous post, i hope it doesn't re-appear.

I respect the decision and understand the reasons that lead to that. I still find it wrong as she could continue supporting the cause from an effective standpoint but there are times where there is no other way to protest and at the same time keep your integrity. Yes. Respect is very important! At the same time Respect includes the concept of Tolerance.

While i certainly agree that sensual dancers to an event may not be necessary, unless you present a dancing game of for aesthetic reasons as an event organizer it fits to your theme to provide the atmosphere i.e. a retro Moulin Rouge theme or a sensual futuristic club etc. Of course, saying that people should not come if they do not like it, is simply wrong! Everybody should be able to participate and feel comfortable being there. These events are for everyone! However i will play devil's advocate here and there are a few questions that arise from this incident. I read about these in various forums with developers and gamers expressing their concerns.

A. It has to be clear, if there were also men along with the women on stage would it be ok? Or is it that we condemn sensual performances in general as part of entertainment considering that it objectifies the members of any gender?

B. If we reach a point to agree that this is demeaning and objectifying a woman, or a man in the case of male dancers do we as an industry condemn these professionals as immoral? Are we calling these performers "sluts"? What is our message here? The message should be clear and respectful.

C. What if certain people men and women don't participate because of the lack of dancers at the party? i.e. instead of offending they find it boring. How would that serve the goal of inclusiveness?

D. What will happen if we all start arguing about things we find or not find offensive at industry events or the workplace? i.e. i hear many guys complaining about tight tops etc not letting them focus at work or certain female members of the team or managers using their sexuality as part of their career or management toolkit. SO are these guys immature and can't control their sexuality, while others are fine to be offended by dancers?

A democratic and all inclusive solution that applies to many such events could be to have 2 stages at the same location. Same as in other cases, a vegetarian and an omnivore buffet. One area could have dancers, and the other could be "clean" and everyone can participate at any stage they prefer and be able to move from one to the other and socialize as they see fit.

Would that be an acceptable solution? Because we must also accept the fact that there are also many men and women that are not offended by sensual dancers nor consider this something that promotes inequality or objectifies any gender. In fact they enjoy such atmosphere.

Posted:A year ago

#5

Randy Marr
Customer Service Representative

12 37 3.1
And the event was probably planned weeks if not months in advance. You make it sound like it was an intentional middle finger to women. It was scheduled entertainment.

Posted:A year ago

#6

Randy Marr
Customer Service Representative

12 37 3.1
Neither is quitting your position and putting one less woman in a position to start working on doing something positive. Instead she just gives up as though her cause is no longer worth fighting.

And as I've said before, the event occurring after her panel has no bearing on the situation. That event was likely planned out well ahead of time. Stop trying to use it as though it enhances the evilness of men. You act as though this were a deliberate measurement to put women in their place, and not somebody trying to entertain a crowd. I'm not saying they didn't choose poorly, but don't confuse intent with accident.

Posted:A year ago

#7

Paul Johnson
Managing Director / Lead code monkey

799 996 1.2
@Yiannis. With your long list of questions, which I'm sure could be extended easily, you put your finger right on the button. You can't please everyone and nobody's opinion of acceptability is more worthy than someone elses. I for one would prefer to live in a world where minority groups didn't command the majority of air time.

Posted:A year ago

#8

Justin Trautmann
Studying Digital Media & Multimedia Technology

24 35 1.5
Was it not DICE 2013 where comments were being made about a more mature industry that seemed to really resonant with many people in the industry and in its media coverage?

Good to know the decision maker on allowing the company to hire dancers for a conference not about dancing or dance accessories used their sound judgement and said, "Yes, I do believe dancers would fit perfectly in this conference for video game makers!'

On a lighter side, though, it would of been interesting to see two dancers dressed like Kratos and Lara Croft enacting an interpretive dance signifying their current game releases and the goal to reach #1 on the units sold charts. They could of dubbed it, "That Which Personifies Us All."

Art!

Posted:A year ago

#9

Howard Parry

23 13 0.6
I agree that the post conference entertainment is sexist, and geared towards men. Indeed you can apply to this to other industries too - in banking, wining and dining clients has always meant taking them to strip clubs and seedy bars. Great when it caters towards the "alpha males" that make up the majority of the industry, but if you get a woman client (or indeed the organiser is a woman herself) then it doesn't work.

More efforts need to be made for the after parties to be inclusive of both sexes - sounds obvious but it's all to easy to arrange "female dancers" as if it was automatic. this requires a gradual cultural change, and the more women who are in the industry, and once in the industry who make a fuss, the quicker this change will happen

Posted:A year ago

#10

John Wilkinson

1 23 23.0
Popular Comment
Some of you above are part of the problem - nothing but relics of an era gone by... it's a shame that you don't know it yet.

Sexy dancers of any gender don't belong at a professional game development conference.

The fact that this still has to be explained to people in the year 2013 is pathetic.

Posted:A year ago

#11

Yiannis Koumoutzelis
Founder & Creative Director

358 187 0.5
Howard, it is as easy to arrange female dancers as it is to arrange male dancers. They are professional performers and they are booked by the same agencies.

Paul i do agree with you that minorities should not dictate what the majority needs, however minorities can't be neglected and discarded either.

John, i could agree with you. It really makes no difference to me. So how do we respond to my 2nd question? Are these performers immoral? Why are we rejecting them? What is our message to the world?

I do believe there is a middle ground to be had, unfortunately nobody seems to be willing to move towards a mutually acceptable situation. It's either my way or the highway. I do not like extremism. I believe in mutual understanding.

In our industry, alpha males and shy people and alpha women, and LGBT and asexual and even people from outer space, veg and non veg :) should have a place, and should be free to do business, party and socialize and have fun in a manner that doesn't provoke. Easier said than done, i know. Because a prude is provoked by different things than a nudist and a 20 year old differently than a 40-50 year old. In our industry we have all of the above! That is the great thing about it! And that is where Tolerance and Acceptance comes in to support Respect.

Otherwise, perhaps we should arrange it so that during the next events security guards also act as a moral brigade! And whoever steps out of line is taken care of accordingly. By the way since i mentioned it earlier, are gay and trans people accepted or should these be dealt with too?

Posted:A year ago

#12

Richard Yaxley
Design / Music / QA

12 9 0.8
Yeah well done John, der Fuhrer has spoken and must be obeyed!

comment #5 by Yiannis is the only balanced and well thought out reaction on this story. What any industry needs is more people like Yannis who think for themselves and don't just jump on the flavour of the month bandwagon like johnny boy here!

Well done Yiannis, I salute you sir, unfortunately people like you are few and far between and that's a real shame!

Edited 2 times. Last edit by Richard Yaxley on 30th March 2013 12:36am

Posted:A year ago

#13

Jonathan Cooper
Animator

5 9 1.8
@John Wilkinson - I couldn't agree with you more.

Yiannis' list is the 100% predictable reaction of the threatened male arriving exactly on cue, and so many participants on this travesty of a thread have jumped in with both feet.

In Leigh Alexander's words from here at GDC, "When people say 'I don't feel comfortable in this space,' it is not an invitation for debate."

Posted:A year ago

#14

Andrew Jakobs
Lead Programmer

223 83 0.4
My god, people who have a problem with the shown entertainment should really get their heads examined. walking through a regular mall will show much more women with much less clothes walking around.. If she has a problem with it, good riddens that she quit..
Really, all the blood, gore and mayhem isn't a problem, but dancers (who weren't even scantily dress on the pictures I've seen) as entertainment is a sin? If that's really a problem for IGDA, then to me the whole organisation can go to hell, damn those hypocrits..

I'm sorry John, but tell me what kind of entertainment is good entertainment? some moronic justin bieber clone? please that would offend more people than those so called sexy dancers (didn't look really sexy to me though)..
And professional game development industry? you mean the industrie that makes games about killing people, bashing the hell out of beings and wreck mayhem? have total war? have hordes of zombies? or having women almost being raped? hell or even say a woman main character isn't going to sell? oh you mean that industry? grow up and don't be a hypocrit..
I've seen real sexy dancers on much MUCH more serious conferences which made the IGDA dancers look like the book-readersdigest women dancers.

And one thing.. bring back the boothbabes.. if formula one can have it's pitgirls, us gamers can have our boothbabes.. (ok, but not dressed in only a thong and taped nipples, that is also where I draw the line for public as also children go to such shows)..

Posted:A year ago

#15

Christophe Danguien
games developer

67 82 1.2
@John, its not pathetic, it's the reality. Seeing the pictures, it wasn't like a strip club either. And as Andrew says, go to any mall during summer, you'll see girls with less clothes on and nobody complains.

As Andrew said as well, you are offended to see sexy dancers at a professional conference but not offended to have to kill people freely as an entertainment ( i.e GTA...Carmageddon ). This is the pathetic thing.

More over, if this woman really didn't appreciate what happened last year, why didn't she quit the first time, cause she thought they weren't going to do that again, well that was quite unrealistic then

Posted:A year ago

#16

Morville O'Driscoll
Games Blogger & Journalist

1,484 1,254 0.8
To answer Yiannis (in no particular order :) ):
Are these performers immoral? Why are we rejecting them? What is our message to the world?
At no stage (afaik) has anyone said that cute dancers are bad. What people are saying is that any industry that repeatedly allows a gender to be objectified without-a-second-thought is not a wholly mature one, and hinders (however slightly) respect towards that gender. That in turn affects the future perceptions of that industry by that gender, which in turn means less of that gender take part.
C. What if certain people men and women don't participate because of the lack of dancers at the party? i.e. instead of offending they find it boring. How would that serve the goal of inclusiveness?
Oh noes! Then this industry would be more in-keeping with academia. No bad thing, excepting of course the lack of women who are asked to present at conferences. Honestly? If a dev says "Oh, no, I don't want to go to a dev conference because there's no female dancers at the after-party" then I would've thought people would be glad to have him not go.
A. It has to be clear, if there were also men along with the women on stage would it be ok? Or is it that we condemn sensual performances in general as part of entertainment considering that it objectifies the members of any gender?
It's about equality, and making the industry a welcoming place for women. If we objectify men then all we do is cast negative light on a different gender; that's not doing anything positive for females. Instead of trying to find ways to bring one gender down, why don't we find ways to bring the other gender up?
By the way since i mentioned it earlier, are gay and trans people accepted or should these be dealt with too?
I'm trying to find where you mentioned this, but can't (not enough coffee? :) ). I will say that what you ask is more related to how women feel than it is about how supportive we should be of people who like scantily-clad-dancers. Sexuality does not equal gender.

And a general comment, related to that last point: Wishing for gender equality and respect is not the same as being a prude, and has nothing to do with being anti-sex.

Posted:A year ago

#17
Popular Comment
These conversations rarely go well, but holy shit there's some nonsense here that needs addressing.

1. Why didn't she quit last year?

Maybe because, as Jessica points out, there was already a stink made about the same events company last year and it was assumed they wouldn't be stupid enough to do it again? Either way, if she'd quit last year the exact same comments would be made, only a year earlier. This is why there's little progress - for some people, there is no acceptable time to bring the subject up, and no acceptable way to broach the subject. The response from such people will always be "Don't like it? Fuck off!"

2. There wouldn't be a problem if they were male dancers.

Well, for one, we don't know that because for some reason no games event that I can think of has promoted itself with a troupe of semi naked men cavorting suggestively. I wonder why that is?

3. People dress like this in real life during the summer so what's the problem?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/context?s=t

4. This was planned entertainment so it's OK.

By this logic, it would be fine to hire a blackface minstrel act for an event, just so long as it was planned in advance. The fact it was planned makes it worse]. This wasn't a spontaneous thing. An events company that had already attracted criticism for this sort of thing just went ahead and did it again, deliberately. The fact this happened and nobody thought it was a problem? That is the problem.

Posted:A year ago

#18

Richard Yaxley
Design / Music / QA

12 9 0.8
@Jonathon Cooper

I'm sorry but that's absolute crap! It's got nothing to do with being scared but more to do with having people like you ram their opinions around the place like they are some kind of undeniable truth. I don't like people telling me what's appropriate behaviour and what isn't. I can judge for myself.

Yiannis is asking questions' THINKING about an entire sphere of problems and is not being black and white.

Posted:A year ago

#19

Morville O'Driscoll
Games Blogger & Journalist

1,484 1,254 0.8
@ Richard

(I find it amusing we're having pretty much the same conversation across two different article comment threads. :) )
I don't like people telling me what's appropriate behaviour and what isn't. I can judge for myself.
Fair. But what about those who can't, don't or won't? Yes, it sucks that people have to censor themselves for fear of offending someone, but seriously? Male Privilege is a thing, and I've repeatedly thought of this

http://www.salon.com/2011/07/08/atheist_flirting/

during these comments. Just because one person thinks something is harmless, does not mean it actually is.

Posted:A year ago

#20

Paul Sinnett
Programmer

7 7 1.0
The fact that this still has to be explained to people in the year 2013 is pathetic.
Pathetic and shameful. I hope people don't form the wrong impression of the game development industry from comment threads like this.

Posted:A year ago

#21

Richard Yaxley
Design / Music / QA

12 9 0.8
@Morville

Yes it is funny we're having this conversation like this. I can appreciate what you're saying and I can understand the struggles women seem to be facing. I honestly have to admit, I've never experienced sexist problems like this in any company I've worked for, people always seem to be very respectful except for the odd bit of stressful rudeness.

I haven't worked directly for many game developers though, so I suppose I cannot really compare the experience.

Posted:A year ago

#22

Morville O'Driscoll
Games Blogger & Journalist

1,484 1,254 0.8
@ Richard

And that's why we - everyone - needs to try and move this forward, even if you think positive discrimination or feminism in general is bad. Because men dominating an industry obviously don't see all the negative situations that can - and do - arise against women. The only reason I notice them so much is because I pay a lot of attention, and read quite a few female-written blogs and articles. :)

Edited 1 times. Last edit by Morville O'Driscoll on 30th March 2013 6:58pm

Posted:A year ago

#23

Dan Pearson
European Editor

92 179 1.9
In the interests of objectivity, I'll refrain from expressing exactly how I feel about some of the comments here, but I will say one thing - they are severely at odds with the thoughts of the majority of industry leaders and forward thinkers I seen and spoken to at GDC this week.

If you honestly believe that the pursuit of equality and proper engagement with gender issues are restricted to a 'lunatic fringe' or vocal minority, then you are very sadly mistaken indeed.

If you expect them to go away or continue to be ignored, then you are setting yourselves very firmly on the path to being left behind by an industry which is quite rightly moving ever forward towards a state wherein it is able to pursue its craft without objectifying, excluding or alienating any of the vastly talented individuals which find this sort of thing utterly antiquated and repugnant.

Posted:A year ago

#24

Yiannis Koumoutzelis
Founder & Creative Director

358 187 0.5
I would agree that this thread is getting out of hand and Jonathan, for sure, i am a "threatened male"! :D
Well played cliché! you got me right there! You really know how to discover hidden traits of people! I am sure you could tell me more about me. And to make it proper, a threatened person actually. One would feel so with so much extremism around. (btw, my wife was rather amused by that "threatened male" line and in fact this whole "dancer" issue )

Since the concept of context was brought in, behold the "semi naked women",
The only thing i actually find debatable is the sense of style.
http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/IGDA2013Photo.jpg

And another interesting element, to put things further in context, the party in question that triggered this uproar, was organized by a company whose CEO is a woman! Maybe she also is a threatened male, as she reportedly stated that she has far more important things to deal with!

"Male privilege"?!?
First time i hear such nonsense, where do people pick up all these terms? Sounds very 18th century. Why are people throwing in phrases that were never used by anyone?

"Just because one person thinks something is harmless, does not mean it actually is."
This exact same phrase is valid even when you swap "harmless" with "harmful" ! Isn't that interesting?

Last and i think it is really going to be my last comment before i become the target of hate as it usually happens in these cases where finding a scapegoat is mandatory, these are questions ANYONE who doesn't stand on either side would have! Anyone who tries to understand the logic and purpose behind all this humiliation of our industry suffers lately in mainstream media. How much more should what we love to do be tossed in the gutter and for what purpose?

The only thing that is achieved here, is further scare people from joining us, and establishing a FALSE impression. Obviously this is a serious matter that is constantly being improved across the industry. The "boys club" has ceased to be for a long time now! And this is something that should further be encouraged and promoted, instead of "staining" a whole industry with last decade's practices.

Edited 3 times. Last edit by Yiannis Koumoutzelis on 30th March 2013 9:37pm

Posted:A year ago

#25

Morville O'Driscoll
Games Blogger & Journalist

1,484 1,254 0.8
@ Yiannis

In the middle of a party, so a more in-depth post probably tomorrow, but...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Male_privilege
Last and i think it is really going to be my last comment before i become the target of hate as it usually happens in these cases where finding a scapegoat is mandatory
But finding a scapegoat isn't mandatory. It honestly isn't. We're all professional people who can articulate a decent opnion about an important topic. Saying that just assumes something is going to happen, and it needn't.
The "boys club" has ceased to be for a long time now!
Look at the comments posted by women here in this thread, the other article about women at GDC, and the Anita Sarkeesian article. If women are saying a Boys Club still exists, then surely - to some extent - it still does.

And, I link to this once again

http://meagan-marie.tumblr.com/post/46396481491/what-would-you-do-if-you-werent-afraid

(and I do hope Meagan does not mind my linking to her Tumblr).

Posted:A year ago

#26

Yiannis Koumoutzelis
Founder & Creative Director

358 187 0.5
I will make an exception and make this my last post on the subject, if anyone wants to further discuss this issue privately i would be more than happy to!

Morville, i am far too many years online to have a good understanding about how things often work and this is the reason why most developers avoid participating in such discussions.

This has gone too far, there was this thing with guns, then the "sweat-house" thing, now this, and I just thought it would be a good opportunity for someone to actually say that NO the games industry is not sexist or exclusive or anything like that! Everyone is welcome. And indeed that is the case! Which is quite the opposite of what this reaction of resigning and things going mainstream actually says! And quite the opposite from what the impression common people (parents and students thinking of a career path to follow) will have about us after this debacle. I bet all sorts of diverse types of people will run to join us after that!

Quite possibly my mistake! ;) It seems like for many people it absolutely has to be true!

Posted:A year ago

#27
Popular Comment
So, let me get this straight. If you spend a career doing thoughtful, intelligent work in videogames, if you've actively campaigned for women in games, been a part of the sex in games special interest group to understand and promote sex in games, if you've been vehemently anti censorship in your approach to videogames, if you're the person responsible for Wizadry and for Train (and relevantly considering the tone here, Playboy:The Mansion also), if you've been an active and productive member of this industry since 1981 and promoting inclusion all the way through your career, you're a "fringe group activist" rather than being one of the people who helped found this industry and shape videogames as we know and understand them, rather than being someone who has fought for them, fought for what you do, what I do and what we all do more than most people in this comment thread ever will in their entire career.

I'm glad we got that sorted because for a minute I thought we were talking about THE Brenda Romero resigning from the IGDA in this article. The sheer ignorance in this thread of who's being discussed and her contributions to the form is embarrassing. Or maybe, hey, doesn't matter, just some girl yeah? I never played them anyway.. I don't know but I do know that http://www.gamesculture.biz has never felt more relevant than when reading this and the other women in games thread.

That you'd trade Brenda and what she does to preserve the opportunity to look at some boobs, well, I dunno, right? That doesn't feel like a good swap to me..

Edited 1 times. Last edit by Robert Fearon on 30th March 2013 10:23pm

Posted:A year ago

#28

Ryan Leonski

25 7 0.3
That party sucked anyways. Went to the Pow Pow event after 10 minutes, so much better.

Posted:A year ago

#29

Tom Keresztes
Programmer

632 239 0.4
if you're the person responsible for Wizadry
Only for Wizardry 8. On the previous ones, she was QA (playtesting).

Edited 1 times. Last edit by Tom Keresztes on 31st March 2013 6:26pm

Posted:A year ago

#30

Bryan Robertson
Gameplay Programmer

86 210 2.4
Do we really have to have a big kicking and screaming match on here, every time someone suggests that the status quo in the industry might be excluding women in some way? Let's say Brenda gets her way, what's the worst thing that would happen? There'd be no scantily clad women at GDC parties. Oh no! The horror! It's political correctness gone mad! Next we'll make it illegal to be a man in the games industry, or (insert some other ridiculous slippery slope fallacy here).

In most sane work places, if I put up pictures of scantily-clad women in my cubicle, I'd get disciplined or fired. It it's not acceptable in the modern workplace, then it shouldn't be acceptable at GDC either, which is supposed to be a professional event.

If you're really so desperate to see scantily-clad women at GDC, go to a strip club after the party, I'm sure there must be tons of them in San Francisco. Problem solved.

Posted:A year ago

#31
According to the CEO of YetiZen, who is a woman, this whole thing is a matter of complete mis-reporting, the pictures the press is using are from a different party, and the girls dancing at the YetiZen party had their outfits approved by the IGDA and covered the midriff.

http://yetizen.com/2013/03/30/official-statement-by-the-yetizen-ceo-on-the-yetizen-igda-gdc-party/2/

What a kerfuffle.

Posted:A year ago

#32

Morville O'Driscoll
Games Blogger & Journalist

1,484 1,254 0.8
Which raises the question - if true - of why the press haven't fact-checked the story correctly.

So... Yeahhhhhhh...

Posted:A year ago

#33

Greg Wilcox
Creator, Destroy All Fanboys!

2,130 1,038 0.5
Er... quitters NEVER win anything, last time I checked.

Well, in America, you can get a gold star for failing because these days, everyone needs to get something, win or lose (bleh). Who's her role model? Sarah Palin? How does a "problem" get solved if all you end up doing is leaving the scene before things get fixed? Eh, whatever...

THAT said, I'm no fan of booth babes and other distractions, but having known a few dancers (from belly to ballerina), I'd think they'd be offended if anyone was down on what they do for (at least part of) a living. Sure, the male-dominated industry (and hell, world) needs to keep some stuff in check, but we're not going to sort out sexism by demanding man NOT look at this stuff and dancers who are primarily paid entertainers NOT work anywhere that seems out of place.

Also, i wonder if this outrage extends to gals promoting dancing-themed or exercise games (they're in skimpy-wear, right?) or cosplayers who happen to be female, in skimpier outfits and say their choice to do what they do EMPOWERS women? Questions, questions, right?

Granted, all I care about at a trade show or press event are where the nearest controller is, if I can score a bottle of water so I don't drop dead of thirst and when's the damn game coming out because the demo is OK, but not quite there.

I've got no answers other than to say both sides need some thought and there aren't many absolutes to fall back on.

Posted:A year ago

#34

Andrew Ihegbu
Studying Bsc Commercial Music

436 146 0.3
Booth Babes are standard issue entertainment. So are dancers, so are pretty girls. Go to any industry conference, be it SXSW, a world drinks fair, CES, Builders association, some Ryanair plane fair thingy I've been too. There's a fair few I have been to - that's just a few - and ALL of them had company hired ladies in skimpy outfits with brand names on their chest/hot pants.

Realistically everyone here is missing the point. These girls aren't there because we choose to 'objectify'. There are there because they WORK. Nothing gets a guy to go to a stall quicker than a pretty face inviting him, whether he's interested in her or not, wife or not. Women 'objectify' themselves everyday, it's called flirting and men do it too. Now back onto the pint. If she sits on the board for all of this, couldn't she herself mandate that they do not do it again, or at least find out if they are doing it and quit beforehand? Seems awfully like a failing PR stunt to quit now, and she can rest assured that they will do it again next year now that all opposition of the idea that was actually in the boardroom (1 person apparently) has quit now.

Edited 1 times. Last edit by Andrew Ihegbu on 1st April 2013 11:12pm

Posted:A year ago

#35

Paul Jace
Merchandiser

868 1,273 1.5
She doesn't look happy in that picture.

Posted:A year ago

#36

Roland Austinat
roland austinat media productions|consulting

120 59 0.5
My five cent: booth babes should be banned from E3 and other gaming events. Not because they are women (in case someone tries to twist my words), but because the games should speak for themselves, not barely dressed ladies who have no connection to them. Male/female models being in costume and incorporating characters from the specific game is something different, though, although I'm not sure if fighters from Dead or Alive might not fall in the former category really.

Back to the party coverage ... fact-checking is a rare breed indeed. Here's some more info on the when and what of the event, as this writer notes: http://www.jacquelineurick.com/2013/03/28/wherein-i-take-an-unpopular-stance-on-the-igdayetizen-party/

Some quotes:

"The important thing to note here is that the party took place the night before the amazing #1ReasontoBe panel – not after."

"I have tons of respect for Brenda Romero, but her twitter resignation left me feeling hollow. She’s been the co-chair of the women in game SIG before I ever became a member of it in 2010. In that time all the SIG seems to be is an active email discussion list. There has been no leadership from her there. What does that title even mean?"

"The same goes for Darius Kazemi, an elected member of the IGDA board of directors, who conveniently resigns 3 days prior to his term end. Darius is out nothing either way and it doesn’t absolve him of not saying anything when it actually mattered. (From the board meeting notes, he wasn’t even in attendance at the February board meeting.) "

Edited 1 times. Last edit by Roland Austinat on 2nd April 2013 12:15am

Posted:A year ago

#37

Eric Pallavicini
Game Master

259 165 0.6
Considering how much debate/reactions there is on each and every single topic that mention or are more or less related to women in the industry... We're not out of those woods yet.

The positive aspect I will retain though, is that at least in the industry women seem free to talk about their own perception of the situation (not the case everywhere), so there is hope. :)

Edited 1 times. Last edit by Eric Pallavicini on 2nd April 2013 5:02pm

Posted:A year ago

#38

Robert Mac-Donald
Game Designer

58 45 0.8
A bit on the side here, but we are slowly creating a culture of prejudice against exhibitionists.

Anyone who enjoys showing his body, or dancing or doing anything with sex appeal is now automatically a bad person that is corroborating with the patriarchy and demeaning his/herself and all those bad words people associate with it. I guess dancers and physioculturists from both genders soon will have to fight for their rights to enjoy their hobby.

Poor Schwarzenegger would have to protest as to how he is still a human being from doing all that weight lifting. Or is showing your body only a bad thing if you are female?

I honestly believe we are reaching a point where the people that get offended at sexualization are just as bad as the people that get offended at gays kissing on the street and think they should only do that in their private space.

Were the dancers out of the place? Was entertainment for straight females lacking? Maybe, and maybe many other of the arguments posted here as well. But getting so worked up on these things is going much further than just claiming for equal rights.

Edited 1 times. Last edit by Robert Mac-Donald on 2nd April 2013 7:31pm

Posted:A year ago

#39

Morville O'Driscoll
Games Blogger & Journalist

1,484 1,254 0.8
@ Robert
A bit on the side here, but we are slowly creating a culture of prejudice against exhibitionists.
Mmmm... I would argue that this isn't quite correct. CosPlayers, for example, are the archetypal exhibitionists, and no-one is going to say that they shouldn't be allowed to go to cons in-character because of the sexual element of some costumes. I would - once again - argue that consent plays a big part in this. That said, as Andreia Quinta linked to in comments in another recent article, some in this industry seem to get confused between consent, exhibitionism, and just plain making women feel unwelcome.
I honestly believe we are reaching a point where the people that get offended at sexualization are just as bad as the people that get offended at gays kissing on the street and think they should only do that in their private space.
Once again (since I said it above) - "Wishing for gender equality and respect is not the same as being a prude, and has nothing to do with being anti-sex." To take myself as an example, I read Violet Blue's sex-and-tech blog Tiny Nibbles, but as you can see from my comments here, I'm very pro-equality.

Edited 1 times. Last edit by Morville O'Driscoll on 2nd April 2013 9:17pm

Posted:A year ago

#40

David Canela
Game Designer

40 68 1.7
How about updating this story with the statements made by yetizen's CEO? You know, just for fairness' sake. This whole thing is obviously a very hot topic right now in which it's getting increasingly hard to say anything thoughtful without getting put into either the patriarch apologist or the radical feminist corner. Under these circumstances I believe it's even more important than usual to give as many sides of a story as possible.

Posted:A year ago

#41

Robert Mac-Donald
Game Designer

58 45 0.8
@Morville
CosPlayers, for example, are the archetypal exhibitionists, and no-one is going to say that they shouldn't be allowed to go to cons in-character because of the sexual element of some costumes.
Reminded me of this: http://www.examiner.com/article/jessica-nigri-asked-to-leave-pax-for-exposing-too-much-skin

Video game cosplay was in fact not allowed because of the sexual element. Funny thing is, I'm not sure if the destructoid guy next to her was told the same thing for not wearing any shirt.

I'm no expert at PAX but I guess the target audience for it is even older in general than those that attend any costume cons. Funny how these two cultures treat so differently these situations. Honestly I don't know what to make of this

Posted:A year ago

#42

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